Marker placement for bilateral shoulder abduction kinematics?

[ryan.fairall]

Hello All,
I am a second semester PhD student in Movement Science and I have a question on where I should place reflective markers to measure bilateral shoulder abduction kinematics? I plan to place markers at both AC joints, both olecranon, both distal radius and ulna, and on the top of each hand on the third metacarpal. Should I also put markers at the top of the strenum and on C7 to use as references? Thanks in advance for any help on this issue. Ryan

[scedric78]

Hi,

Maybe you should have a look to ISB recommendations:
Wu G, Vanderhelm F, Dirkjanveeger H, et al. ISB recommendation on definitions of joint coordinate systems of various joints for the reporting of human joint motion?Part II: shoulder, elbow, wrist and hand. Journal of Biomechanics. 2005;38(5):981-992.
Available at: http://linkinghub.elsevier.com/retrieve/pii/S002192900400301X

Cheers,

Cédric

[ktroy60]

Hi Ryan,
We've done quite a bit of upper extremity motion work in our lab. We use the following marker set, along with some custom written code (Matlab) based on the ISB standards to get the kinematics:
r 2nd metacarpal
r radial styloid
r ulnar styloid
r medial epicondyle
r lateral epicondyle
r glenohumeral center of rotation on the posterior shoulder (ie your best estimation of this location by palpation)
r acromion process
c7
t8
sternal notch
xyphoid process
all arm and shoulder markers on the left-hand side too.

this marker set doesn't give you any scapular kinematics, but will give you humerus relative to the trunk.

I agree with the recommendation of checking the ISB standards: shoulder motion can become very difficult to express if you stick to flexion/extension and ab/adduction terminology. The standard nomenclature is much less ambiguous.

If you have further questions feel free to contact me.
Karen

[pgarofalo88]

Hello All,
I am a second semester PhD student in Movement Science and I have a question on where I should place reflective markers to measure bilateral shoulder abduction kinematics? I plan to place markers at both AC joints, both olecranon, both distal radius and ulna, and on the top of each hand on the third metacarpal. Should I also put markers at the top of the strenum and on C7 to use as references? Thanks in advance for any help on this issue. Ryan

Hi Ryan,

tracking shoulder/scapula kinematics is currently the second challenge among the community (the clavicle is the first).

However, there are some very good attempts in the literature.

For measuring kinematics not only of the humerus with respect to the thorax but also the overall shoulder complex check this:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19221823
I think you will find this very useful.

A nice review which might help you is here:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19679479

For measuring scapula kinematics (but not using reflective markers), instead, look at this:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18087742
This is a brand new tecnique.

How to choose/create the protocol will depend on your specific application.

If you need more information do not hesitate to contact me.

Pietro Garofalo

[latc80]

Hi Ryan,
I actually use a modification of the ISB set for my work with softball pitchers. On the throwing side I use: C7, T8, Scapular offset (on opposite, posterior scapula), sternal notch, inferior sternum (2-3 inches below sternal notch; the ISB recommendations call for xiphoid process but with females, that's challenging), AC joint, med/lateral elbow epicondyles, medial/lateral wrist, and head of 3rd metacarpal.

11 markers total (15 if you need bilateral). I also use custom software developed in Labview, so your choice of marker sets may decide on your software method for obtaining kinematics.

Feel free to contact me if you have any additional questions.
Laura

[ryan.fairall]

Thanks to everyone who posted. My first experience with Qualysis went pretty well thanks to your advise and recommendations. I'm sure I'll be posting in the near future with more questions. Ryan