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Replies - flesh simulants part two

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  • Replies - flesh simulants part two


    Following my posting of replies re: flesh simulants, I have recieved some
    more ideas. I think the most useful approach will be for us to use a
    combination of leather and gel. Cheers Zach!! The target does not have to
    mimic skin exactly as it will be covered by an anti-stab vest anyway but
    I guess the results will be more accurate if we use a target which is as
    realistic as possible.
    As some people out there were interested in the results of my
    query I thought it might be useful to post a second summary. Thanks once
    again everyone!

    Judith Lane
    University of Strathclyde.
    Hi Judith:

    The replies you received on your query of "flesh simulants" was rather sparse!

    Back it the late 1960's, PhD student Jim North and I at the University of
    Strathclyde evaluated "chamois leather" against human skin. It provided a
    "good" representation of the dynamic non-linear characteristics of human
    skin (creep and stress relaxation). Not surprising considering it is still
    the basic fibre-composite and contains a number of the original
    glycoproteins . . . But the main point is that it's "clean" and readily

    Finlay, Evans, North, Gibson & Kenedi (1972). Dynamic and structural
    characteristics of human skin: a comparative study with chamois leather.
    Proceedings of the 18th Annual Technical Meeting of the Institute of
    Environmental Sciences, held in New York, May 1972; pp. 94-111. Copies
    available from IES, 940 East Northwest Highway, Mt. Prospect, Illinois 60056.

    At that time, John Evans and the Tissue Mechanics folk at Strathclyde were
    interested in the impact characteristics of tissues as they relate to
    head-screen impacts in cars. The work may be referenced in Jim North's
    thesis "Impact characteristics of human skin and subcutaneous tissue",
    Strathclyde, December 1972.

    I'm just off to Toronto for the week - job hunting. If you need a copy of
    the paper, drop me a note and I will get to see it next weekend.

    Best wishes:

    Bryan Finlay
    Professor (Part-time), Medical Biophysics
    University of Western Ontario

    61 Hampton Crescent 519-472-1346
    London, Ontario 519-473-2645 FAX and Answering Machine
    Canada, N6H 2P1



    I read the summary on the flesh simulants. I can just add some
    information. The address of "Limbs and Things" is:

    Radnor Business Centre
    Radnor Road Horfield
    Bristol BS7 8QS England
    tel : +44 0272 446 466
    fax: +44 0272 446 222

    Best Regards,

    Dirk Twisk
    Ir. Dirk Twisk
    Biomechanics Section
    Crash-Safety Research Centre
    TNO Road Transport Institute
    Delft, The Netherlands

    On Wed, 29 May 1996, j.lane wrote:

    > Hi,
    > My colleagues and I are investigating some of the kinetic and kinematic
    > parameters involved in the action of stabbing someone with a knife. We
    > are using a Vicon system to track the motions of the arm and upper
    > body.The knife consists of a blade and a custom machined handle into
    > which is inserted a pylon transducer.
    Just curious, but what inspired this study? Forensics? Or something

    > Currently the target consists of a box of special plasticine which is
    > supposed to mimic the properties of flesh and is the standard target for
    > tests of this kind. However, we feel that the plasticine does not
    > sufficiently simulate either skin or muscle and thus will significantly
    > alter the force-time profile of the knife at impact.
    I do know that the U.S. Marine Corps. use "dummies" which are supposed to
    have the properties of human flesh for bayonnet drilling with their
    recruits. Whether or not you can get information regarding these dummies is
    another story entirely.

    > I heard that there is a company somewhere, possibly in Europe, that
    > produces a gel with similar properties to flesh. I have tried looking
    > through the Biomch-l Yellow Pages and the Archives but have had no joy. Thus I
    > wondered if anyone out there had come across anything similar or had any
    > suggestions. We have thought of using an animal carcass but are very
    > reluctant to follow this route.
    The studies involving ballistics and the trajectory of the bullet(s) which
    killed Kennedy were conducted at the Ballistic Research Lab in Aberdeen,
    Maryland (USA). In this study, sheep carcasses were utilized to simulate
    human flesh.

    > Thanks for your time and I hope to hear from someone in the near future!
    Not that I am going to be involved in such studies in the near future, but
    I would be interested in finding out what you come up with. Best of luck.

    > Judith Lane.
    > Research Assistant,
    > Bioengineering Unit,
    > University of Strathclyde,
    > Glasgow,
    > Scotland
    Tim Niiler
    University of Delaware Sports Science Lab
    Biomechanics and Movement Sciences


    Hi Judith,

    (I first read you subject line as Flesh Stimulants
    - interesting diversion.)

    You've probably decided on your final approach by
    now, but on reading your summary I had this idea.

    Cover a slab of gel with leather. Make sure the gel is
    pretty thick, because it has to give under the impact.
    If you are worried about the leather being too tough,
    Courtney's group will be able to help you tan a piece
    of defatted skin with minimal cross-linking.
    (Cross-linking using formaldehyde, glutaraldehyde, etc.
    is much the same as commercial leather tanning.)

    Good luck


    -- Santosh Zachariah --

    Center for Bioengineering [ph:usa (206) 685 3488]
    Univ. of Washington, Box 35225 [fax: 543 6124]
    Seattle, WA 98195, USA